samedi 29 octobre 2022

So, Starting to Answer ... 1 & 5, 2, 3a ...


Is Joseph = Imhotep Still Defensible? · So, Starting to Answer ... 1 & 5, 2, 3a ... · 3b) they think the Egyptian defense was too good for a people to invade them + compression

Take points 1 and 5 first.

1) Doesn't lead to any controversy with CMI. Nevertheless, the point I am coming from is, by the time of the Trojan War (which Christian scholars over centuries have seen as a real series of events, even if some explanations, like the magic about Achilles "invulnerability" would be misrepresented) carbon dates and real dates have started to merge.

This happened before King David, so, by the times of Solomon and Rohoboam, uniformitarians would no longer be misdating things from back then (other than slightly).

5) The most salient parts of the LXX chronology is of course Genesis 5 and 11, and the differences between Roman martyrology and Ussher after these times would be due to other things. Nevertheless, I do have some regard for scholars who did this calculation, notably St. Jerome, so, I would place Exodus in 1510 BC and the beginning of the soujourn 215 years earlier, 1725 BC. And I am here speaking of actual years, not misdating due to undue regards for carbon dating or Egyptian lore.

This brings us to beginning of the soujourn the number 2 in previous.

2) They put him under a Hyksos pharao. An Egyptian one, they argue, would have hated shepherds. Once they got an Egyptian one, the hatred for Hebrews took on.

My objections would be:
a) for reasons of that chronology, I am putting Joseph before any Hyksos pharaos;
b) the Egyptian hatred for shepherds dates from when, and how intermittent or durable was it?

So, for instance, would someone in the Old Kingdom already be hating shepherds (Djoser was in the Old Kingdom)?

3a) they think the Hyksos came with the chariots, so must have preceded the chariots of the pharao

My tables place the Exodus in the real year 1510 BC, but in the space between carbon years 1671 and 1618 BC, these being my values for the real years 1521 and 1498 BC, 11 years before and 12 years after the Exodus.*

This means the Hyksos could well have arrived with chariots and if they were Amalecites, this could be pharaos who did not know Joseph.

The problem is, these values come in a table where the salient years at the start and end with nodes are 1590 at birth of Moses and 1470 at taking of Jericho, and I posed Sesostris III as dying at the birth of Moses. This is based on ...

Searching for Moses
by David Down | This article is from
Journal of Creation 15(1):53–57, April 2001
https://creation.com/searching-for-moses


and when trying to find it right now, I saw there had been some debates on it ...

I think I'll pause and see how that debate went.

Hans Georg Lundahl
Paris
Day after Sts Simon and Jude
29.X.2022

PS, after pause** : 1) David Down's view on Exodus need not be linked (though it was in his case) to his wholesale acceptance of Velikovsky's chronology, taught under Sir Colin Renfrew in Cambridge, apparently; 2) he wanted to have Thutmosis III as Shishak; 3) both he and his critics assumed:

JDA
Secondly, if you move the 12th dynasty forward 350 years, you have to move the rest of them forward by the same increment as well. This would place the New Kingdom (the 18th and 19th Dynasties) existing from roughly 1200 BC to 950 BC.
DD
Yes, it does mean that other dates have to be reduced and that includes the 18th dynasty, but that is a bonus because it brings Thutmosis III down to the time of Solomon and Rehoboam and identifies him as the Shishak of 1 Kings 14:25.


My tables are on the contrary assuming a compression between 12th and - for instance - 22nd dynasties, with - for instance - Shoshenq I still as Shishak.

I have not so far taken into account the possibility of a compression this far on. Except in much earlier versions of my tables, where the meeting point of carbon and real is more like Babylonian destruction of Jerusalem. Which is too late./HGL

* Creation vs. Evolution : New Tables
https://creavsevolu.blogspot.com/2020/08/new-tables.html

** Pdf from 2006:
https://creation.com/images/pdfs/tj/j20_1/j20_1_43-44.pdf

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